It’s a fantastic night to be a Canadian. Two to three political parties are setting aside their differences to save us $300,000,000 on a new election that would change little. Democracy in action is frightening to people who are used to seeing it broken… look for a lot of scared people this week, especially those who call themselves “Conservatives”.
Harper will probably try to delay the confidence vote until January (budget on Jan. 27), but will fail… sort of like his clumsy attempt to rule with a majority mentality.
–
Hat tip to Raphael
UPDATE:
CBC is reporting that Dion would be PM in the new government. This is a good idea because if it’s an unpopular government, he’s on his way out anyway.
–
CBC puts the same news into a new URL.
ADDED:
No sooner was the speech ended than the Prime Minister and his Finance Minister left the House, along with half of the Conservative caucus. The faces on those that remained told the story in vivid detail. Listening to the response from the three opposition parties, you could tell from their countenance some kind of line had been crossed.
In the Opposition Lobby, I saw things I had never witnessed in my two years here. Bloc members were “high-fiving” NDP caucus members, and some women from the Bloc were embracing their counterparts in the Liberal caucus. It was incredible to watch.
–
Hat tip to ITQ
@hotmail.com
![[EFC Blue Ribbon - Free Speech Online]](http://www.efc.ca/images/efcfreet.gif)
Kelvin Ye | 30-Nov-08 at 10:53 pm | Permalink
What makes you think he’ll fail in delaying the confidence vote until January?
Saskboy | 30-Nov-08 at 10:56 pm | Permalink
Because it’s a total cave in. The last months the NDP and Harper have been tearing down Dion for not showing up to vote on bills in the House. Now Harper wants to force a delay? He’s a total chicken; a perfect Yellow Party leader.
Raphael Alexander | 30-Nov-08 at 11:10 pm | Permalink
Ah Saskboy, I’m glad one of us happy about it.
:)
Ryan Cousineau | 30-Nov-08 at 11:11 pm | Permalink
Alternate headline: “NDP, Liberals in league with Satan.”
Not that the Conservatives didn’t show considerable hubris in the proposal to revise party funding, but they’ve backed down, which is the mandate of the governing party.
What Dion got mocked for was not dodging the votes in the House; it was swearing up and down that he opposed those bills, that they were unconscionable for Canadians, but then not actually voting against them.
Do I have to link to the video?
Anyway, the NDP and Liberals are free to try to form a new minority coalition if they can bring down the Conservatives, but they’ll have to govern with the consent of the Bloc. It will be interesting to see what the costs are (both in terms of what they concede to the Bloc, and in terms of how Canada sees it) to that approach.
Zach Bell | 30-Nov-08 at 11:12 pm | Permalink
Many of the blue blooded among us are murmuring about how Harper should prorogue parliament. Wouldn’t that be a larf! End the first session of parliament after only two weeks!
Good fun all in all.
Ross | 30-Nov-08 at 11:13 pm | Permalink
If there isn’t a delay in the confidence vote I think that just enough Liberals are not going to show up for the vote so it’ll pass, but they can still say they didn’t vote in favour of it. The Liberals don’t have the cajones that the NDP and Bloq, in my opinion this is why The NDP were bargaining with the Bloq to form a coalition before they spoke to the Liberals.
Ross | 30-Nov-08 at 11:23 pm | Permalink
If the Bloq doesn’t officially sign on, but only says they’ll vote to prop up the coalition, this coalition will have 114 seats(if we assume,the independants stay that way), versus the conservatives 143. Wouldn’t the GG be obligated to call an election and refuse this coalition unless the Bloq added their 49 seats which would put the coaltions seat count above that of the Conservatives ? Just asking.
Saskboy | 01-Dec-08 at 12:01 am | Permalink
Ideally, you’re correct Ross. The GG can do pretty much anything though if the coalition convinces her that it will work.
Incidentally people should look at this:
http://www.abandonedstuff.com/2008/09/05/harper-is-as-back-ward-michaelle-jean-should-tell-harper-to-form-official-opposition/
and
http://www.abandonedstuff.com/2008/09/07/awe-heck-why-do-we-even-pay-a-gov-general/
Louise | 01-Dec-08 at 6:03 am | Permalink
Saskboy, you didn’t read the article, did you. You have at least a couple of points completely wrong.
“”The real obstacle to this deal going through is still within the Liberal party,” Boag said, adding the deal is being negotiated by Dion, who believes he has the right to be prime minister.
But it’s unclear whether the party wants him to continue, and the leadership candidates were meeting Sunday evening to discuss the matter, Boag said.”
“On Sunday, Flaherty said the government would deliver the budget on Jan. 27, about a month before one is normally tabled in the House of Commons.”
And holy shit!! The NDP get 25 cabinet seats. They only have 37 seats in the House. How’s that for democracy?
There’s a few more details here. If this one it to be believed, Iggy will be PM. Good thing, too. He’s the only one in the current crop of Liberals who I can stomach. But anyway, this is looking more and more like the chaos in Italy in the 1970’s and ’80s.
Louise | 01-Dec-08 at 6:06 am | Permalink
Ross, you’re bang on. This coalition has just handed the future of Canada to the Bloc. They will hold the balance of power. Real smart move.
Saskboy | 01-Dec-08 at 7:56 am | Permalink
Louise, as usual you’re desperate to show that I’m wrong, to the point of making yourself look ridiculous. Read the article. 25 seats! HAHAHA
seven star | 01-Dec-08 at 11:19 am | Permalink
This isn’t democracy, this is a power play led by the man who will do anything to be PM, Mr Jack Layton. The fact that they were talking about this long before the last election should sound off alarms. Layton proves more and more that he’s a sleaze, and the fact that they are asking a separatist party to prop them up is ridiculous. This has nothing to do with the economy and everything to do with jack’s desperation to be PM, or hold a cabinet position. If this happens, this country will be out of control because there is no way any of them would agree on anything other than toppling Harper.
Saskboy | 01-Dec-08 at 11:39 am | Permalink
This is democracy, it’s the majority coming together to rule, instead of the minority that has been propped up by a broken electoral system, a separatist party, and weak kneed opposition. Every fault found with the coalition in power can be found with Harper. Who would you rather have as Prime Minister? It’s an easy choice I think that Dion deserves the position, and Harper does not.
They have plenty to agree on besides toppling Harper: They’ll bail out the Big 3 (I don’t agree with that really), they might bring in PR elections, they will fund the arts, implement a carbon pricing system, etc.
tracy | 01-Dec-08 at 3:11 pm | Permalink
Hi-fiving and hugging. As they say, a common enemy breed allies.
Harper really shot himself in the foot and needs to resign. I live in Harper’s riding and I can’t stand him.
But Seriously? A leader who abstained from voting on any bill for a year, ran one of the worst campaigns ever where 75% of Canadians rejected him, going to resign as party leader in May, becoming the new PM of a coalition government?
Surely there has to be a better way than giving all the power to the Bloc. Let’s have an election with new leaders.
MacKay V Ignatieff perhaps?
seven star | 01-Dec-08 at 3:26 pm | Permalink
Better yet, lets just have another election to end this once and for all. I don’t think Dion deserves this as pointed out above. You must be kidding me ,are we supposed to look up to this coalition and think that they can govern properly, while the PM ran a pathetic campaign which resulted in lost seats? And to throw support behind a coalition propped up by a guy who wants to tear this country apart seems unpatriotic and Canadians shouldn’t be happy.
seven star | 01-Dec-08 at 3:29 pm | Permalink
that should say
“are we supposed to look up to this coalition and think that they can govern properly, while the coalition PM ran a pathetic campaign”
Saskboy | 01-Dec-08 at 3:56 pm | Permalink
Tracy and Seven Star, Dion may not have run the best campaign, but he was working with a smaller budget, against unfair smears by a well funded Conservative attack/smear machine, and had an idea based campaign while Harper had no platform until the last week! And he’s united the NDP and Liberals with a cool calm from the Bloc, after working with the Greens earlier. He’s a statesman who got important things done for Canada, and he’s not even PM yet. It works out well for Canadians because they avoid an early election ($300,000,000 more down the tubes?) that would change the seat count very little. And the majority gets the progressive government they voted for, but thought they would never see. Christmas is coming early to Canada.
Oh, and right now it’s HARPER who is propped up by the Bloc. How is that better? Any argument against Dion can be thrown back at Harper, seriously.
tracy | 01-Dec-08 at 4:07 pm | Permalink
Agreed. Harper propped up by the Bloc is no better. Harper needs to resign.
But having a leader that lost the election this poorly doesn’t sit well with me. Has Dion really calmly united with the NDP and the Bloc or has he been duped? How do you know this will work any better?
I think both Harper and Dion are imcompetant and we need a new election with new leaders and see where that goes. I’m positive it will result in a majority for one side.
Saskboy | 01-Dec-08 at 4:11 pm | Permalink
But EVERYONE “lost” the election; Harper included. Layton lost more than Duceppe, but he’ll have cabinet ministers, and may be one himself! The point is people have to shift their thinking to adjust to the reality of the situation. Opposition parties are legally, and legitimately taking power from a leader who has lost the confidence of a MAJORITY of the House. Parliament is actually working; it’s a Christmas miracle!
tracy | 01-Dec-08 at 4:21 pm | Permalink
Settle down Settle down. :)
I know you’re excited but
you don’t know if it’s working yet. You don’t even know if the GG will accept this yet. Let’s wait a week and see what happens.
If it’s such a good deal then why aren’t the Bloc ‘officially’ part of it? If it was a pure 3-way deal then I’d have no problem with it. I have to respect the wishes of the MPs.
But what’s holding the Bloc back. This ’support’ thing is fishy to me.
Saskboy | 01-Dec-08 at 4:32 pm | Permalink
It’s probably related to them not officially recognizing Canada, so would be hypocritical to hold cabinet positions. It’s fishy they supported Harper this long.
the muffin man | 01-Dec-08 at 4:55 pm | Permalink
This Socialist Government is the worst possible news that I’ve heard in a while. Better hide your wallets my friends, because the socialists are coming…
huffb1 | 01-Dec-08 at 6:31 pm | Permalink
no more minority governments! next election I want there to be an elected Majority government. I don’t care if its Liberal or Conservative. No more Minority’s!
People need to get more involved in the political process.
Amanda | 01-Dec-08 at 7:16 pm | Permalink
Bring ‘im down!!!!!!
Go democracy go!
–from a Conservative
Zach Bell | 01-Dec-08 at 8:36 pm | Permalink
Loiuse
And holy shit!! The NDP get 25 cabinet seats. They only have 37 seats in the House. How’s that for democracy?
BWAHAHAHAHA! Some one’s propensity for rushing to ideoogically motivated condemnation is showing.
Seven Star
This isn’t democracy, this is a power play led by the man who will do anything to be PM, Mr Jack Layton.
this absolutely is democracy. Democracy is frankly a joke but heck, that’s what’s at work here. To deny it is to show your ignorance of how the parliamentary system of government works,
Parliament works so long as the majority of House of commons has confidence in the leadership of the Prime Minister and his cabinet. Harper was elected with a minority government and so he had to work hard to maintain the confidence of the house. The majority of elected representatives of the people lost confidence in the PM and so decided ti would be a good time to form a minority government of their own.
That’s how parliament works. Frankly, no election need be held for 5 years if the members of parliament want to trade the PMO for a while back and forth.
Tracy
But Seriously? A leader who abstained from voting on any bill for a year, ran one of the worst campaigns ever where 75% of Canadians rejected him, going to resign as party leader in May, becoming the new PM of a coalition government?
Frankly, the liberal deputy leader should be the PM until the liberals determine their leadership. That being said…that’s how a coalition works. People are thinking of this kind of thing in singular terms.
This party got that much of the vote and that party got this much…blah blah blah. That’s irrelevant. What’s relevant is what kind of vote count the coalition members received from the electorate all put together. A coalition doesn’t govern from one party’s position; a coalition governs from multiple party positions and so their combine vote count is perceivably more relevant than what one of the party’s got for a percentage of the vote.
Tracy
If it’s such a good deal then why aren’t the Bloc ‘officially’ part of it? If it was a pure 3-way deal then I’d have no problem with it. I have to respect the wishes of the MPs.
Ugh…first I gotta point this out to Drew Remenda and now you. The Bloc Quebecois has stated for years that if they were in a position of being able to be a part of a coalition government, they would not do that. The Bloc works as a part of parliament but they have consistently said that they will never sit in government caucus and they have said that for years.
The muffin man
This Socialist Government is the worst possible news that I’ve heard in a while. Better hide your wallets my friends, because the socialists are coming…
The socialists already arrived. The conservative gave away $75 Billion to the financial sector. What exactly is it that make the conservatives anything BUT socialists?
huffb1
People need to get more involved in the political process.
True dat homes!
Mooner | 01-Dec-08 at 8:44 pm | Permalink
This is a night for Canadians to take a long look in the mirror and ask themselves…..”what the hell are we doing electing some of these boobs”? Imagine for a moment Prime minister Dion!!!! My God what has become of Canada. Why have we been hijacked by fools…how could we have allowed this???
I can understand why you Liberals and NDP’ers are wettin’ your pants over this cause this is as close to power you fools are going to get for a long time.
I’ll bet Jack Layton has had a woody all day just waiting to walk into a cabinet meeting…..what a sleazy, slimly little prick!
If you take a moment to look and listen to what is going on across Canada tonight you will find most people who are tuned in to politics to be horrified and ROYALLY PISSED OFF…….I make no bones about the fact that I support the Conservatives…but I will tell you I’m not impressed with Steven Harper right now…..what he did to antagonize the Lib’s, NDP, Greens and Bloc with the funding cut was like waving a red flag in front of a bull…..he was an IDIOT!!!! It was time for him to learn a lesson to learn to play nice with the other kids in the sandbox…..but this crap has now taken on a life of it’s own and someone has to put a stop to it….NOW!!
I am hoping and praying that Harper prorogues Parliament and lets everyone stop slobbering on themselves in their lust for power and take a step back from the brink. Now it not the time for this.
As a Canadian I am sickend by this, to think I send tax dollars to all these assholes and this is what I get for it! I want my money back! I used to be a real political junky but lately this crap has been way too much for me…..I am going to join the 90% of Canadians who don’t pay much attention and will probably live a much more peaceful life.
huffb1 | 01-Dec-08 at 9:22 pm | Permalink
Mooner, I agree with all your points, but your going to far by saying
“I am going to join the 90% of Canadians who don’t pay much attention and will probably live a much more peaceful life.”
What we need is more of the public involved in the political process.
Michael Hewett | 02-Dec-08 at 2:21 am | Permalink
According to Elections Canada in the last federal election The Conservatives as well as gaining the most seats in Parliament won 71 out of 87 seats in the four Western Provinces, and the Liberals won 2. Now the Eastern based Liberals want to take over the government, and, with the support of the separatist Bloc, the NDP and a Liberal appointed Governor General could well achieve this. We would then be led by probably the most incompetent Liberal leader ever, or alternatively a leader who was not even elected as such, with strong pressure to give away even more goodies to Quebec.
After suffering the depredations of the Liberal National Energy Policy, the Progressive Conservative F18 contract, and the threat of Dion’s green shift (National Energy Policy lite) and making every effort to work with the Governments dominated by Eastern Canada what do we have. The eastern based parties are attempting to overthrow a freely elected government because they want to continue feeding at the taxpayer funded trough. And where does that funding come from, mainly from the West, and where does it go, mostly to the East.
Let’s face it, the Liberals can’t even run their own finances sucessfully. Are we really ready to trust the country’s finances to them.
I am really angry about this, and if the Liberals succeed in contriving with the NDP and Bloc to overthrow a party with good Western representation, I will be strongly inclined to reluctantly give up on Canada and work for Western separation. I hope this doesn’t happen, but if it does I’m sure there will be many Western Canadians who share my view.
Impassive « The General Wolfe | 02-Dec-08 at 2:32 am | Permalink
[...] Saskboy - pretty mainstream. (in a post called My Heart Could Burst) It’s a fantastic night for Canada [...]
Abandoned Stuff by Saskboy :: Because the Alternatives Cost Another $300,000,000 or Blood! | 02-Dec-08 at 8:57 am | Permalink
[...] This is what happens when a bully pushes around too many people at once. The bullied finally realize that they are more powerful than the bullier, and push back! Hard! [...]
Saskboy | 02-Dec-08 at 9:11 am | Permalink
What is it with all these Conservatives acting like they were elected to power last election. They lost votes country wide, they got fewer than 155 seats with 308 available, and they needed the support of the Bloc to maintain power. Then Harper said he was going to gut the Greens and other parties’ funding so they couldn’t contest the Conservatives in the next election. Mooner’s right, Harper is an idiot.
And people who fail to recognize a peaceful, and necessary transfer of power need to consider the alternatives right now.