This is pretty sad. I also think these victims are not taking the safest route to justice or their healing.
This kind of story makes me nervous about visiting Florida in the future - How do I know a prosecutor won’t decide that 59Mph = 78Mph?
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Brad | 15-May-08 at 2:25 pm | Permalink
To me it is sad, if it is true that she was raped and justice was denied. But to me every person is innocent until proven guilty beyond a REASONABLE DOUBT and not just on a woman’s word. North American society has gone too far (not for this alone) and because of this men have less rights then pets. Also I do think it a true statistic that 1 in 4 American woman are sexually assaulted under the age of 25. Too many feminists in the continent want superiority and not equality. I am sick of it and reverse discrimination is rampant in society.
Talon | 15-May-08 at 2:44 pm | Permalink
This is a sad thing it really is it also makes you think… What has our country come to????????????????????????? =O=O=O=O=
This is very good that people are listening.=Pd =OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
=F
Brandy | 15-May-08 at 3:34 pm | Permalink
And how do you prove that you were raped beyond a REASONABLE DOUBT? How is that possible? Rape means that one person did not consent to sex. It does not mean that the perpetrator is a stranger or that the perp beat the victim physically into submission. If a person uses verbal abuse or intimidation (which leaves no bruises) it is still rape. If the two people are dating and one does not consent it is still rape. “No” is “NO” even if you are in the middle of a hot and heavy make out session. Brad, you are right that statistic is most likely inaccurate. It is more likely 1 in 3 women. This nation needs a reality check. A woman (or girl in this case) owns her body, no man has the right to do with her body what he pleases by force, intimidation or violence. She can wear what ever she wants and choose to do with her body what ever she wants, but if she says “no” at ANY TIME, it means “NO”. If a man continues, it is rape!
Saskboy | 15-May-08 at 4:13 pm | Permalink
But Brad, “But to me every person is innocent until proven guilty beyond a REASONABLE DOUBT and not just on a woman’s word.”
That’s moot, since the point of having an absolute age limit like 15 being unable to give consent for sex, is so that if you know when the sex took place, that it did take place, and the age of the parties, then you can arbitrarily say it’s RAPE. The prosecutor shouldn’t have that discretion they excercised.
Zhu | 15-May-08 at 4:29 pm | Permalink
“One in four American women under the age of 25 report that they have been sexually assaulted, ”
That’s a lot. This is what worries me the most in this whole thing…
dont worry bout replying i wont look at this | 15-May-08 at 5:18 pm | Permalink
it looks like she’s lying what was she doing drinking and doing drugs with a 22 year old dead beat. Asking for it.
Saskboy | 15-May-08 at 5:43 pm | Permalink
Don’t Worry, an adult might realize that is risky behaviour, but the bottom line is that the 22 year old was the one asking to get charged with a crime!
Mike | 16-May-08 at 2:15 am | Permalink
Who Knows if she is Raped, Its Our society to be blamed, This whole dating business…Yes business. If she doesn’t feel like giving it to him, she shouldn’t go out with him.
Lot of boys like me feel Girls just use us and make fun of us, just cos we like them. I hope she is not one of them who used this guy to get high.
Of course the guy will expect something in return. STOP going on DATES
Devon | 16-May-08 at 5:33 am | Permalink
Hm, if I am not mistaken, according to the cnn article, BOTH admited to having a sexual relationship. And that she had given consent.
I have a problem with this, because in fact, florida law states that a 15 year old cannot give consent. So, if a 15 year old cannot give consent, then it is indeed rape.
Innocent until proven guilty doesn’t apply, because according to the cnn article, the male admited to having sex with someone who legally could not give consent. This is RAPE then. It don’t matter if she was 1 month away from being 16, she still is NOT 16, that then makes her STILL 15.
And according to the law, her rights were violated.
Louise | 16-May-08 at 6:30 am | Permalink
Don’t worry?? “Asking for it.”??????? Sigh. After all these years we still have dinosaurs among us.
Adam | 16-May-08 at 6:51 am | Permalink
Wow, are you kidding me? This is a PERFECT example of why laws that draw straight lines regarding age restrictions for anything are wrong. I applaud Florida for this. This girl is obviously lying, and got mad at her boyfriend and decided to get back at him. What is truly an injustice is that so many people blindly believe her. THAT is the crime here.
Adam | 16-May-08 at 6:56 am | Permalink
Need to add:
1. the unlawful compelling of a woman through physical force or duress to have sexual intercourse.
2. any act of sexual intercourse that is forced upon a person.
THAT is the definition of rape. THAT is why Florida is right. Do you HONESTLY believe that this lying girl would have been ANY more prepared for sex in 1 month? These laws are meant to help defenseless children, not random party girls who cant keep their legs closed.
Mike | 16-May-08 at 8:49 am | Permalink
Thanks Adam. I’m 26, so high school and its subsequent BS were not that far back for me. There is a DISTURBING trend of girls who cry rape because of relationship issues in high school. I’ve been the friend of girls who are like “josh cheated on me, i’ll just say he raped me and get back at him”
And uh.. a 23 year old dating a 15 year old? Would NEVER be my daughter. If your kids are doing shit like that behind your back, you’re an AWFUL parent.
If i were her parent, i’d whoop that ass for broadcasting the whole shindig on youtube. it’s bullshit, it’s NOT the way to solve it, it’s NOT the way to get help, and it’s NOT the road to recovery.
stupid, stupid little girl.
Saskboy | 16-May-08 at 9:10 am | Permalink
Except she got a national media outlet to announce to the world that the Florida prosecutor is a pile of crap. That isn’t a bad thing if the prosecutor’s boss takes notice, and fixes the problem.
Mike, you’re blaming the child (legally, she is), and letting the 23 year old off the hook completely? Shake your head, man. Adam, you too need to have more respect for children, and less for child statutory-rapists.
Adam | 16-May-08 at 12:31 pm | Permalink
The moment she CONSENTED to having sex with him the first time, she became an adult in my opinion. I dont care what the law says. If she was 15 years 11 months and consented, it makes NO DIFFERENCE in maturity level than 16 years 0 months. The law is wrong. Period.
How about this. Oral sex is illegal in 14 states. Lets go arrest EVERY single person in those states who has done that (Which by my guess would be about 90% at LEAST) and put them in jail, just because its a law.
Saskboy | 16-May-08 at 12:43 pm | Permalink
It’s arguable that a 16 year old could even consent to sex with a 23 year old, Adam. That’s why there’s a statutory rape law, because children with parents who abandon them to 23 year olds looking for sex, need protection in the law instead.
Louise | 17-May-08 at 7:02 pm | Permalink
I’m with Saskboy on this one. The issue is the difference in age between the he girl and the man. There are lots of slutty 15 year old girls out there and they are almost always victims of child abuse, often sexual abuse. A 22 year old who behaves as an adult should, wouldn’t go anywhere near a 15 year old if he was really an adult in the full sense of the word. He needs a good ass kicking in the courts. She needs some good family counselling. I’d be saying the same thing if the 15 year old was a boy.
I d
Louise | 17-May-08 at 7:11 pm | Permalink
Drat!! (I’m using my son’s laptop and I’m not used to the keyboard.)
I was going to say that I don’t know what Saskatchewan’s law has to say about this, but I do know that in other jurisdictions the difference in age between the two parties has a big role to play in whether or not sex with a minor is considered rape. If a 17 year old whose birthday was only last month has sex with a 15 year old who turns 16 next week, it cannot be considered rape. But a gap of seven years makes a big difference in leveling responsibility when the “victim” is only 15.
Boba Fett | 17-May-08 at 9:53 pm | Permalink
There are two sides to this argument. Accept that.
Given society today. I’d say she’s an Immature little girl taking things WAY too far. That’s my opinion. None of us can debate reliable what happened as we don’t know. It’s all effectively speculation.
If it was indeed the conventional idea of rape. (in my eyes being, held down and pumped) Then it would have reached a higher level much sooner. The fact that 1 in 4 women under 25 say they’re raped I think shows how a lot of it is most likely absolute tripe and by tripe I mean. The guy is likely to not deserve imprisonment. But this whole ordeal alone, the fact it’s reached the internet should probably probe himself to think more about his actions. WTH is he doing with a 16yrold. Sort your life out, she wasn’t worth the effort, was she?
Boba Fett again | 17-May-08 at 10:01 pm | Permalink
Not meaning to sound callous. But it would seem 1 in a million girls don’t fall to societies lowering morals.
Besides. You have to admit the whole thing is screaming “slut”
Send em both to jail for being so damn stupid/immature.
I don’t do political debates. The law is a bulls hit system. You have to take the world for what it really is. You’re all practically arguing arguments that aren’t yours.
Why am I even commenting on this. Because how I envision her is what I see in 9 out of 10 girls nowadays and I feel your arguements are too clouded by the law. Ok that IS the discussion at hand but come ON. Get real!!
Saskboy | 17-May-08 at 10:07 pm | Permalink
Boba, when it comes down to the law, there aren’t two sides, you’re either 16 or you’re not. It’s possible to debate if the law should be changed, and it is debated in Canada, here, every year.
I have a feeling that your idea of rape, may not include date rape, and that’s a problem. As you correctly pointed out, the 23 year old dude needs to do a lot of introspection as to what kind of person he is, and to learn from this. He took advantage of her, and now she’s getting back at him the only way she knows how (since the justice system let her down).
You’re putting a lot of blame on a statutory rape victim though, and that’s a problem. “Slut” or not, women don’t cause rape against women. He was supposed to be the adult, and she is a young adult. He took a chance, and she lost.
9/10 girls may be overly sexual in your opinion, but ask yourself why they are that way. Are you making things easier for them not to be, by discouraging corporations from using sexual advertising? Are you doing anything to reduce the problem other than blaming children for growing up how the media tells them they should be?
Adam | 18-May-08 at 12:15 am | Permalink
I have seen the court filings, and by her own admission the sexual interactions between them were 100% consensual. She states that most of the times she was under the influence of drugs and/or alcohol, but that is NOT an excuse. At no point did this guy force her to drink or do drugs. At no point did the guy “slip a mickey” into one of her drinks. She was fully aware of what she was doing, and entered into it with knowledge of the situation (Per her admission that even with the occasion of the first sexual encounter, she demanded the guy wear a condom).
My problem in this situation is not the moral issue. We all know that a 23 year old man has experience enough to be able to take advantage of a situation such as a drunken teen girl, and should have had the foresight to stay away from her. My problem is that this girl is now doing everything she can to ruin this guys life simply because he broke up with her (She also admits to filing a report against him initially because he broke up with her, prior to the rape charge).
If any of you have seen the video she posted on YouTube, you will notice that she makes claim to living in poverty not once, but several times. How in the world does that play into anything? It makes me think she is out for money, or her family is. That, along with her own admission of what happened during her relationship with the accused, calls EVERYTHING she says, or has said, into question.
Finally, the question of statutory rape. I’m sorry, but if she was capable of demanding a condom while under the extreme influence of drugs and alcohol, she must have been well educated in the ideas of what sex could result in. Because of this, it would appear to me she made an educated decision, and THAT should be what the law is based on. So many of our laws and judgements are determined by knowledge of the event in question, ability to know wrong from right. She obviously was capable of making the decision. Statutory rape laws should be changed to reflect the following statement:
“If the alleged victim is proven to be competent enough to make a decision regarding a sexual act, then the act shall be deemed consensual, except in the case of gross misconduct.”
That would protect BOTH sides. But, thats my opinion.
Saskboy | 18-May-08 at 12:38 am | Permalink
Thanks for making an attempt at explaining your opinion. I still don’t agree, because how do you know the 23 year old didn’t ruin her life already by the simple act of having a sexual relationship with her? Whether she ruins his in this case or not seems completely dependent upon his mistake/crime, and it’s hard to feel much sympathy for him. Why are you empathizing only with him, and not her?
Louise | 18-May-08 at 2:24 pm | Permalink
Saskboy is right on, on every count. A 22/23 year old who gets entangled with a 15 or 16 year old is the one who is asking for it. Period. There are some things that a mature, aware and responsible person just would not touch with a ten foot pole. The hypersexualization of young girls by the media should make that cautionary tale doubly important. The girl is a sicko who has been led to believe that the putting out is a means of obtaining the love she longs for. At 15 or 16, she’s too stupid and naive to know otherwise. If the man has been stung by this encounter, let that be a lesson to him. From here on, maybe he will act like an adult instead of a selfish doofus. If the girl is still behaving the same way when she gets to be 22 or 23, maybe she’s incapable of learning any lessons, but not at 15, especially because of the hypersexualization of girls. If she comes to her senses, on the other hand, maybe she can work to clean up the media’s portrayal of teen sexuality so girls will not be targeted with the “slutty is cool” message and 20 something men will understand that young teens are off limits, no matter how they behave.